Brian Dodridge

Key Interview Component: the Cultural Call

Photo contributor: Grafner via iStockphoto®

As a church, before you start asking a lot of interview questions of a ministerial candidate,

first, talk about you.

We recently hired a campus and teaching pastor for our newest regional campus. For this pastor, I followed the same selection process we use for all ministerial hires. In one of his last group interviews with us, he commented about one step in the section process. He spoke about the value of the “cultural call” we had with him. At the time, he was unsure of the benefit of the hour long call that unpacked our church’s history, mission, community demographics and more. One it was a lot of information. Two, I was talking the whole time and not asking him any questions (even though he’s the candidate). And three, much of the information wasn’t about the specific church campus he would pastor. Despite his natural reservations, we’ve discovered great value in the “cultural call” (click here for PDF template). It was created prior to my time, I’m just a grateful recipient of the work. Benefits of the cultural call:

It provides context for the ministry opportunity to the candidate
It’s shameless about presenting the facts about your church’s situation (whether they’re selling points or not)
It establishes things that are in place, and will not be heavily influenced by the candidate
It lets a candidate know what they’re getting into
It gives them an understanding of the church’s leadership structure and how decisions are made

When they’re done with the call, a candidate has a pretty clear picture of where the church is at, where it’s been, and where it’s going. They can then determine if it’s a church they want to be a part of.

Practical takeaway:

Create a “cultural call” template for your church to use in your own selection process. Ours can provide you an outline and then you can tweak it and add in your needed information.

There’s been a time this call ends the interview process with a candidate. When a candidate gets this much information, they can often determine whether they can see themselves serving with us. And in some cases, they don’t see themselves fitting well. And there are other times when our unapologetic explanation of our mission, objectives and where we see God leading us is a big affirmation to what God has burdened their heart with.

p.s. If you want to read about what I consider to be the needed first step in hiring, click here for a blog post and free resource.

Is Your Ministry Calling Too Comfortable?

How comfortable should you be, in the place you’ve been called?

Every once in a while, God chooses to show me what my ministry-calling could look like…how uncomfortable it could be.

He showed me once when I was interviewing with a church. On the weekend I was there for an interview, a 160 missionaries were being commissioned to international service. It put my “sacrifice” of moving 800 miles within my own country into perspective.

He showed me again this past week when I visited a church pastor in the inner-city, who explained to me his calling for his neighborhood. I didn’t find many things attractive about his neighborhood. He puts his four kids in physical danger by living in that neighborhood. Only 20% of his congregation has jobs (and those pay minimum wage). The thing that’s most attractive about his neighborhood is God’s calling him to it.

Sometimes God reminds me my calling could require more sacrifice than it currently does. I also hear Him whispering, “It might require that sacrifice in the future.”

I believe I’m where God has called me to be. And there’s nothing inherently wrong with living in suburb and working in a healthy church where the largest danger I face daily is driving to work. There’s nothing wrong with all that…Unless God has called me to be elsewhere.

It’s all relative. But, there’s something about seeing fellow ministers whose calling doesn’t provide them with security or soft furniture in their office that teaches me to be grateful.

It teaches me how to pray for others.

It should teach me not to get comfortable.

It should teach me to not trust the place of my calling, but rather, to trust the One who called me there.

I want to be able to always say “yes” to whatever God’s calling is on my life, without hesitation – whether it’s to a nation with ISIS militants, to Chicago’s inner-city, or to Williamson County, Tennessee.

Comfort is fine… as long as the feeling of comfort comes from knowing you’re exactly where God has called you to be.

When A Backward or Lateral Move Is Okay

Photo courtesy of iStockphoto®

Church staff members aren’t exempt from a ladder-climbing mentality. We’re not exempt from wanting more pay or recognition. We’re not exempt, but we can’t allow that mentality to drive our decisions.

As a Christian, and one whom has fully given your life’s vocation to Christ, you must pursue and prioritize that calling first, and above all else.

While living in Texas, I served a great church as Executive Pastor. However, I felt like God had a different church for me to serve. The opportunity God presented was a church in Nashville that already had an executive pastor. So, what was I to do? (Stage a coup, perhaps?)

The church did, however, want to offer me the role of “Associate Executive Pastor.” It was an executive pastor, but not THE Executive Pastor. Was I okay with the demotion? Was I going to be okay not only being a second-chair leader to the Senior Pastor, but also to the Executive Pastor?

When people asked about the new position I was leaving for, would I be okay with verbally inserting “associate” before the rest of my title?

There may be times in your ministry when God calls you to be in a place or position that seems like a step backwards, or sideways. It could mean less title, less money, less authority, and less recognition.

Sometimes it’s clearly a demotion of sorts. Other times, it may just seem that way. But either way, you’ll have to decide on the front-end if you can deal with it.

When I was making my decision, it helped me to realize that pursuing the call and position God provided me is never a demotion. I had no idea what God would allow me to do as Associate Executive Pastor. I couldn’t understand the value I’d gain in the “associate” role, and I didn’t understand how the role would unfold over time.

If you’re ever in this situation, here are a few reminders about when a lateral or backwards move might make sense:

When you feel God telling you to do it
When it’s best for your church
When you’ve got more to learn
When a new supervisor could help you develop
When it gives you the best opportunity for the long-term direction you want to go

When you feel God telling you to do it – God is sovereign over your ministry career-path. Don’t fight it.

When it’s best for your church – There could be short or long seasons when your taking a different or lesser role is best for the church. It could positively impact other staff, or be a healthy financial adjustments for the church. Many people avoid these moves, by moving away from the church. In some situations that may be what needs to happen, but consider first what’s best for the church you serve.

When you’ve got more to learn – This was true for me. The associate position put me in a place to learn a lot more about the role. I wasn’t prepared to lead in THE executive pastor role. I benefitted from first learning more.

When a new supervisor could help you develop/make you happier – A move laterally or backwards could put you in an excellent seat to learn from another person. A change in scenery, a change in reporting, can give you a new perception. This was true for me. I benefitted significantly from the Executive Pastor. I wouldn’t trade that learning opportunity to have had his seat at the time.

When it gives you the best opportunity for the long-term direction you want to go – God may or may not reveal this to you on the front-end, but sometimes a pause in the ladder-climbing allows you the greatest opportunity to get where God desires you to be (and rings true with your understanding of your calling).

p.s. I’m quite confident eternity will not include name plates, business cards, org charts or résumés.

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